Forum:Admin Consensus: Vivaporius

Gentlemen, today we meet here to discuss the current crisis involving User:Vivaporius. Since his joining, Mr. Viva has accomplished his goal here on Conworlds. He has shown himself to be a troll. His goal, as he admitted to earlier this year, was to join Future World for the sole purpose of engaging in harassment and deliberate irritating roleplay to piss off me. He openly stated to Superwarmonkey and myself, that he joined Conworlds for that sole purpose. This is based solely because of his personal hatred for my original conworld, the Union of Everett, which in game, supports liberalism, equality and other agendas that he in his personal real life, heavily disagrees with, most notably, the gay rights issue. As a result of his joining Future World, he proceeded to create Mandinka, which later because Kisiwa and now Huria. His nation, of course, its primary notable stances, were extreme anti-gay behavior, in which is mass murdered homosexuals and then attempted to do so, across the world in game. He has also condemned by President, for being a lesbian while most of his activities in FW have in some way, revolved around the idea of exterminating homosexuals, as seen in Brazil, Jamaica, across Africa, etc. When we attempted to create Atlion, Viva chose to not work along side his fellow players, but to disregard the entire point of the Atlion project and create a state, so hateful and vicious, like Huria was in FW, that he repeatedly threatened to secede his state from Atlion and engage in war, an absurdity, as the entire Atlion project had nothing to do with war at all. This again, was because of course, by his hatred of homosexuals and anything remotely liberal, demanding Ixania be allowed to be a religious dictatorship type state, and adamantly demanding his state be allowed to disregard the Constitution of Atlion for the sake of forcing his personal radical Conservative beliefs of the Atlion project. The result of both his participation in Future World and Atlion was the chasing off of multiple good behaving and well known players, including BIPU, who grew tired of Viva's constant war assaults against major world powers and exterminating entire populations with magical combat methods and metagaming and powergaming. Superwarmonkey, abandoned the Allied States as part of Future World and created a new game, to get away from the disarray. Viva instead then joined New Era and proceeded to do the same insane activities as seen in FW itself. Oddly, while claiming he is not racist, sexist or at all violent, every project Viva has taken part in and developed, revolves around extreme racism against whites, anti-semitism, violent and murderous hatred of homosexuals and sexist comments against women.

In closing, Vivaporius has shown himself unable to participate in community projects, by refusing to abide by simple rules, work along with others and continues to even now, harass, intimidate and make attempts to engage in or spark arguments and fighting with others and now, as seen in Future World, with Everett gone, Huria has returned far worse than before, genociding Jews in Israel with "death camps", invading and devastating the United States and former Everett, invading and taking over large masses in South America and wiping out most of the planet in FW roleplay. This behavior cannot be tolerated. Of all evidence showing Viva's problematic participation here on Conworlds was in fact the post of a talk page in which he openly admitted to joining Conworlds for the sake of pissing me off.

Vivaporius needs to be banned permanently. I now request fellow Conworld Wikia admins, sysops, mods and other major and long time players and users to review and understand these facts so we can create a joint consensus on putting a stop to Viva's out of control behavior.

Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 23:14, October 20, 2012 (UTC)

Discussion
Odd, I invade Israel and now I'm anti-semitic... ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 23:31, October 20, 2012 (UTC)

Viva never said he joined FW "with the sole reason of trolling UP". 77topaz (talk) 00:01, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

77, he in fact did. He actually did post that. Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 00:12, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

He just told me he never did. 77topaz (talk) 00:18, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe it would help if you could link or quote my words. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 00:30, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

The quote: "And no I did not. In fact, I'm sure I never said anything regarding my reasons for joining. Period. I don't even know where the trolling bit is coming from. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 23:53, October 20, 2012 (UTC)
 * Check out Huria's talk page. That was only place I posted for a good month before I branched out into other articles. And the UN meeting talk page. You'll find all of the arguments betweens UP and I there. And tell me if that appears to be trolling or just simply anger of another's views. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 23:56, October 20, 2012 (UTC)" 77topaz (talk) 00:43, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Gentlemen, the Prosecution presents Exzibit A:


 * "Well now. Congrats on 6,000 edits. Guess I can tell you my recent moves in FW now. I wanted troll UP. Make him angry by putting a nation hated near his home soil. That was generally it. After that heated debate with him, and his lousy points, I know I wouldn't last long. But I made it count, and that's all that matters. Well done! I'll be in NE shortly, but I've got some stuff to handle first. --"Truth fears no questions..." 02:29, August 15, 2012 (UTC)"


 * Located: Exzibit A


 * As a result, Viva was banned that same day: BANNED

Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 00:45, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

That was just about the Barzona Brotherhood thing, or whatever it was called. The Hurian refugee state in North America. Not Huria. 77topaz (talk) 00:50, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

The Baridian Brotherhood, I mean. 77topaz (talk) 00:52, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Indeed. I think I should been more specific. I wanted totroll you in-character. Your short temper and self-righteous disposition blinded you to that. Rather than consult the issue with another admin, you over-reacted, and made the matter a bigger issue than it should have been. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 00:57, October 21, 2012 (UTC)


 * You know it had nothing to do with "in-character". It doesn't matter if it had to do with Baridia or Huria or anything. The facts are his intentions to deliberately engage in harassment or "trolling". Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 02:56, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
 * That may be so, but the previous section says that trolling was Viva's "sole reason for joining FW", which would be incorrect. 77topaz (talk) 03:05, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

It's "Exhibit" and not "Exzibit". :P 77topaz (talk) 01:44, October 21, 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks, spell check said it was apparently correct even when I tried to fix it. Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 02:56, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

I, Mr. Craftian, hereby support the movement made by The Right Honourable Mr. Planets. (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (  Duestchland - Texas - Sagesse - Oil City - Skandinavia   ) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 03:33, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Allow me to take the stand. Thank you. First off, the gentleman from New York is a liar and a tyrant. Why so? Well allow me to start with his own statements. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 23:35, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Hi guys. The evidence is solid, but a permanent ban is not necessary. Perhaps a temporary ban, for a month or three months, would be more appropriate? —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 23:19, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Have I know already presented my case, and proven that this has more to do with UP's own agenda than anything else? Have I not gone though everything I could to prove that; for the last frickin' time, this is hobby, and not my one-stop location to spout my political and religious beliefs unlike UP? Have I not stated since the first time I joined that I do not need to put my beliefs into my work? Or that I have more than two nations and a state to prove that? UP's intolerance and inability to actually see the difference between real life and a fictional universe is terrible, and given the fact that he knowingly lied about my intentions is appalling. Gentleman of the jury, I demand justice! ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 23:35, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

I have reviewed your case and unfortunately I don't agree. Your refusal to cooperate and improve is what makes your behavior unacceptable. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 00:07, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

Excuse me, but I have indeed cooperated. When the Brazilian invasion wasn't popular, I left. When Ixania's lawyers refused to marry gays, I agreed to have them do so. When the players in NE didn't what an African-American nation, I changed it to an acceptable one. I have cooperated when asked by Super, and when improvement was called for, I did. If there was no improvement, please point it out. If there was no cooperation, point it out. Woogers himself stated that UP abused his power just to control the actions of another player. Super stated that I wasn't the reason he left, and I can even quote them myself. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 00:26, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

Exhibit A
"The result of both his participation in Future World and Atlion was the chasing off of multiple good behaving and well known players, including BIPU, who grew tired of Viva's constant war assaults against major world powers and exterminating entire populations with magical combat methods and metagaming and powergaming."

The result of BIPU leaving is both unknown and apparently something that anyone can pin to myself. Proof? BIPU had been neck deep in making his own setting, and had already been demanding realism aspects for Future World two years before I joined. How do I know? On Future World's main talk page, BIPU and Super suggested a slowdown of FW's unrealistic tech development, and the need for more realism after FWNG was started. Indeed, how could I have been unrealistic if the game itself was already unrealistic to begin with?

Now on to Everett. Mandinka's invasions were indeed large, but could anyone explain how 125,000, then 175,000, and later 200,000 drones were appearing in enemy country's overnight? Or the magical appearance of a quarter of a million marines in Southeast Asia? Everett's overpowered PDS weapons that prevented other players from fighting his nation? Was that not unfair and thus powergaming? His leader's teleportation abilities to arrive at the UN and ramble on about matters that were for all intents and purposes ended OOC. Clearly an example of metagaming.

The pipe piper himself has launched ridiculously invincible invasions of other nations for personal gain. He invaded Iran to force government change. He invaded Lebanon and killed tens of thousands. He invaded Georgia for reasons that seem pointless. And all without losing any real number of men. Totally unrealistic. Huria's invasions, while indeed bloody, are what you would expect if you had two well trained forces fighting for the future of the other. Brazil has a well trained army, and they faced enslavement. Would Mandinka losing 100,000 men appear unrealistic and invincible, or just what you would expect for a military force using D-Day tactics?

Now a trained mind would ask; "How is Viva even getting 100,000 soldiers over sea?" Well that simple. Like most people capable of reading basic text and any novice knowledge of military techology, I use landing ships, which were capable of holding thousands of men at a time. Indeed I never made an article about it, but I just thought people would know about them. When I told UP about them, he had a "that's not possible" moment, and basically destroyed the historical event know as the Battle of Normandy with his response. How effective are these ships? From Wikipedia: "The RMS Queen Mary and the RMS Queen Elizabeth were two of the most famous converted liners of World War II. When they were fully converted, each of them could carry well over 10,000 troops per trip."

Exhibit B
"Superwarmonkey, abandoned the Allied States as part of Future World and created a new game, to get away from the disarray. Viva instead then joined New Era and proceeded to do the same insane activities as seen in FW itself."

Ah the most memorable moment. As I told UP, and watched him twist, Super did indeed leave FW to escape the chaos, but that was a long time coming. He cited nations such Mandinka and Everett to be major factors for his leaving. And I'm pretty sure invading Brazil is a lot less insane than a nation forcing a quarter of a billion people to take tracking devices. As foe New Era, while I did indeed create Nuwaubia, when it became clear that it wasn't going to be welcomed after changes, I renamed it for the sake of peace. Now that's not mentioning the Northern Coalition military government...

Exhibit C
"This again, was because of course, by his hatred of homosexuals and anything remotely liberal, demanding Ixania be allowed to be a religious dictatorship type state, and adamantly demanding his state be allowed to disregard the Constitution of Atlion for the sake of forcing his personal radical Conservative beliefs of the Atlion project."

I was under the belief I would be allowed to decide my domestic policy, and acted accordingly. I choose to not marry homosexuals in my state out of my moral beliefs, not my hatred. But having a narrower view than a Republican has blinded UP to that as well. And let us remember UP's four year history of forcing his own personal beliefs on the FW project, for we all know well that he is letting them run here now. When I realized Ixania would cause more harm than I had it disconnected.

Exhibit D
"He has also condemned by President, for being a lesbian while most of his activities in FW have in some way, revolved around the idea of exterminating homosexuals, as seen in Brazil, Jamaica, across Africa, etc."

To quote yourself "Read your shit". I condemned her for being a "radical liberal homosexual". Apparently you blocked all of that out. And I said so to bring out the importance of the fact that in modern America, such a woman would not have made it into the presidency for reasons that the majority of Americans are opposed to them. Additionally, I even stated that five times elsewhere if I remember correctly.

And if I can remember clearly, I offered safe passage for gays and lesbians in Jamaica. I wasn't protecting them from the Hurians, but from the Jamaizans, who [wikipedia:LGBT rights in Jamaica|actively attacking OOC]. Apparently you forgot to mention that too UP. And consider the fact that only in Brazil did my forces actively hunt them down. Nowhere else do you see that. But, UP won't tell you that because he knows this too.

End
Now while I am sure that I have much more to consider, first allow me to point out of things. First, UP has clearly lied in regards to stating my only reason to join was to troll him. Second, exactly what did I say about Spencer that was sexist? And third, in what way have I shown I must be racist? UP, please present your evidence. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 14:24, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Okay I'm sick of this
Instead of being Stately and skimming on the true subject of this conversation, why don't we just truly and honestly take a vote? Who actually and honestly wants Viva to remain on Conworlds. May I remind you to be 100% honest. And no, this doesn't gave to be taken as the official thing. I just want the Admins to see the popular say. (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (  Duestchland - Texas - Sagesse - Oil City - Skandinavia   ) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 00:43, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

VOTE

 * LET HIM STAY
 * ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 00:50, October 22, 2012 (UTC) (For obvious reasons)
 * Enclavehunter (talk) 01:10, October 22, 2012 (UTC) (Permanment ban is to extreme)
 * 77topaz (talk) 04:36, October 22, 2012 (UTC) (same reason as Enclave)
 * MAKE HIM GO
 * (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (  Duestchland - Texas - Sagesse - Oil City - Skandinavia   ) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 00:43, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
 * -Sunkist- (talk) 01:20, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
 * kkthxbai TS KITTYKAITI :3 :4 lol 06:08, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
 * LIKE A BOSS, PSYRAX (Speak Your Peace) 06:14, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
 * --Falloutfan08 (talk) 07:41, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

Defense 2.0
I've been going over UP's list of my "crimes" and other material, and I have development my defense. Now in regards to me running off the players. Let's start with BIPU. BIPU never said that it was Mandinka, but you all simply speculate that it was. He stated his reason was the unrealism of the entire game itself; all nations were guilty, and in his conservation with Woogers, BIPU stated that no regards for cost, time, or resources were the reason he left to make his own game. Now on to Super. After he left, I took upon myself to apoligize. He told me that I did not need to and that Mandinka wasn't the culprit; stating that he had considered leaving for a while, and that long before I joined, Future World had been failing.

In regards to cooperation. From the time I joined, I did indeed cooperate, even seeking advice from UP himself when I was shown wrong. When I first made Mandinka, I modelled it off of Everett, and parts of it I mistakenly modelled off of Future World Next Generation. At the take, I didn't know they were two seperate games. Additionally, after observing the quick development rates that drove BIPU out of the game, I once again made the mistake of make Mandinka nine years old, which made no sense development wise. Thus I changed its formation to 1951. I even did what BIPU suggested, and he was my response "And for the sake of keeping the peace, I'll be lowering the overall nation GDP. --"Truth fears no questions..." 18:52, April 20, 2012 (UTC)" I explained a number of times how Mandinka was able to prosper within the 60 year limit three seperate times, and was even told it was clear for usage. Now, whenever I fight between myself and UP began, after saying what I needed, and noticing that UP was not going to stop, I apoligized and sought to see it ended.

What makes that so important is the fact not only did UP refuses, and continue one with the arguement, but the fact that I didn't start them to begin with. If you look at the pages UP and I were arguing on, you'll notice that UP left some kind of insult or smirking remark, and when I responsed, he left more, which led to the arguements. When I was banned the first time, I said exactly what UP himself said. I thought I was simply joking when I said "I just noticed, Uganda is a part of Huria. I guess there are no better words than; "Get the hell out of my nation". UP in all of his geneius, took it as an insult; "Instead of being an asshole about it, the fact you claimed blank territory as part of your nation..." My response? "Okay then. And remember, I can drag up all of your insults from memory. I've tolerated your rude behavior, so don't complain. You don't want me to be an a**, don't be one. Now, can you place the article in storage?"

The following banned was for "Lacking the ability to communicate", which was the same manner UP was acting himself. And he even had the nerve to tell me that my responce was "uncalled for" when his was as well. Regardless, I always showed UP the respect he wanted since he was a wiki admin. I didn't go out of my way to start fights with him because he was the administrator. That was a fight I was just going to lose either way you looked at I. Yet, when trouble came, it came from him. Even on minor articles, he was rude. I made an article about a stealth craft, and he simply stated, "That can't be a stealth craft", and left it at that. No reasons as to why or how, just that one cryptic message. I had to ask him to tell why just so I could fix the issue. One another article, he only said "Don't connect this nation to the other FW articles until it is passed, and also, WTF?". Once again, another cryptic message he never responded to or even tried to explain. He has been like this for the last seven months, and now try to imagine cooperating with that. I have tried to the best of my ability too, so you can't say I didn't.

Now the infamous invasion of Brazil. Yes, the invasion was stupid, but we had a number of nations invading countries all over the place. Yarphei invading Thailand; Everett invading Iran; the ASA invading Zimbabwe; and many, many more. My invasion was only different because I invaded Brazil. Regardless of UP's statements, I don't see any magical about using landing ships and converted cruise ships to carry troops to Brazil (as I already mentioned the RMS Queen Elizabeth was converted during WWII to carry 10,000 soldiers; x10 that 100,000). Midway through the conflict during a chat session, I popped the question as to why I invaded Brazil, and I was thinking of having the event retconned. UP in his most civil and thoughtful voice, stated "because you felt like being unrealistic." No I had no intentions of being unrealistic, but just wanted to enjoy the game. That insult drove me to commit myself to the conflict, and led to the fighting that marred Mandinka's reputation.

No when you say that I have been hostile toward UP for no reason (despite his insults), let us not forget his statements that I have no ability to seperate reality from fiction. This is the greatest mystery of all. Please bear with me on this. First, UP says that because I created Huria I must be a violent and intolerate person. He is basing this fact off of a ficitional nation. Now when I stated a thousand time Huria does not reflect my beliefs, UP stated they do, taking a ficitional nation's word over the real author's word. Now if this reasoning is applied to all of my other nations, then Tawhid would say I'm a radical Muslim, Oceania would say I'm a Polynesian liberal, Nuwaubia would say I'm a black supremist, Huria would say I'm a Neo-Nazi, Ruthenia would same I'm a reactionary, the American Empire would say I'm an ultraconservative, and the Ivory Coast would say I'm a moderate conservative. So ow could I not be able to seperate reality when all of the accusations against me have been from the game itself.

I shall continue with my case at a later date. I turn it over to the jury. ((ლ( (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ( 17:44, October 22, 2012 (UTC)