Those of us who care are going to finalize this here. Now, I BEG of you all to see this from a ATLION viewpoint and not <YOUR STATE> viewpoint. I'd like us to be able to compromise and not be selfish about what we've "already decided" for our states. I am sure history was intended to be for all of us to decide upon collectively from the beginning and NOT for each of us to make it up for our own states. Now, I propose the following:
- The British and French are the dominant figures in Atlion's history.
- French arrived first in Sagesse.
- All of this happens a considerable amount of years before North America is found.
- The British arrive a while after the French, during some or other war, which can be real or made up.
- Brits arrive in Ixania and spread to Intima and Broker, and make Ixania one province, and Intima and Broker one province.
- Brits spread west from Broker while the French spread north from Sagesse, essentially dividing the country in a southwest (British) / northeast (French).
- Perhaps another war between the Brits and French.
- Brits win the war (obviously).
- Around the same time as the American Revolution, the Atlionese Revolution begins.
- It ends long after the American Revolution.
- States are divided IN A WAY THEY ARE NOT TODAY.
- In the mid-1800s, we get our current borders.
Ixania was never under British control. It was owned by the French until the late-1600s, then the slaves took over. From then on to the late-1960s or 70s, Ixania was a seperate nation. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 21:13, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
Alright, so that's your proposal for Ixania. I guess we'll have to have numerous votes, including if certain states were separate or not, and which course of history to follow. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 21:24, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
See Super, this is why I said your making Atlion your game. Ixania is my state, and I should have the right to establish its history as I see fit. I'm not going to ask for anybody's permission to do that. Your in no position to make us vote on if we can develop our states the way we want. Do that mess with your own state, don't make us do that with ours. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 21:40, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
- Of course I mean that in the polietest way possible. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 21:43, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah, I don't care anymore. You're always the one working in the other direction... and I mean ALWAYS. ALWAYS. I cannot emphasize that any better. You just don't care what other people think, even though we're all supposed to be a team. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 21:45, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
See, Viva, this is where I am a bit upset with Ham for the language he used. He said something which made everyone think that this is like Future World or New Era or Nearly Real World, where everyone can just follow their own paths. Now, if you are not seeking to cooperate or collaborate or just in general compromise where if a democratic vote tells you to, then you can leave, if you don't want to leave, you'll follow what we vote for. I don't care if it seems like I am making this my game anymore, I am leaving everything up to voting, not me dictating terms. But whatever, Ixania won't be part of Broker's canon of Atlion until you're either gone or decide to be a team player. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 21:45, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
I don't care what you want Super. Your telling me I have to follow the history set by everyone else, when nobody else was even concerned with making up the history of other state. This is more of a "you" problem. I was just fine with being a team player until you waltzed in and told us we have to choose each others history democractically. That makes no sense, and I'm not working like that. If you have a problem with it, and your the only one who did (with the anthem, the way we could make our states, and even the cultures), then you leave. Everyone else was perfectly fine, your the only one making up the rules. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 21:50, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
We need to decide on the natives of Atlion yet. Hmm, how do you think we'll fit the Russians into all of this, or did they come later on through immigration? -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 23:18, September 21, 2012 (UTC)
Right now the only logical place from natives to come from would be West Africa, where the inhabitants had the technology to travel the seas like the Mali and Morrocan people, and the trading states nearby. The second would be from the Americas, though it would be much harder to explain since none of the native there had any noteworthy sea-faring capabilities. Of course, the island could be completely uninhabitated given that it is rather isolated. As for the Russians, they could have come from the inhabitants attempt to carve out a successful colony for the Russian Empire, or an attempt to flee the oppression of the Tsars. Remember, the Duchy of Courland was located in Latvia, and managed to establish a colony in West Africa. I'm pretty sure the much larger and wealthy Russians could have done a better job for a landmass close by. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 00:52, September 22, 2012 (UTC)
Don't attack me for mentioning this, but I think it would be better if the French took over the Sagessic Shield and Ixania, and by the time Britain had established colonies north and south of Sagesse they invaded Sagesse and supported the slave revolt in Ixania. After fighting a bitter war with France over Sagesse, the French surrendered the territory formally to Britain. But Pro-France resistance established the Union of Sagesse that would basically be like the Stormcloaks in Skyrim. The Union was able to muster up a considerable amount of support in the shield, and then continue fighting until the end of the Atlionese Revolution, where the Union joins Atlion as a state. That's my take on the French colonial history in Atlion. (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (Duestchland - Texas - Oil City - Skandinavia) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 04:04, September 22, 2012 (UTC)
Hmm. I'm still focused on keeping Ixania as a country or a parter in a loose alliance. Kinda like the U.S. during the confederation. Ixania keeps a military, currency, and government system, but is a part of a larger nation which is the Union. Then it join Atlion along with Sagesse as part of that union. I think it would make sense as Ixania is the "Honorable Union" of Ixania, right? ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 05:12, September 22, 2012 (UTC)
That's basically what the Union of Sagesse is, a large rebellion against British rule over Sagesse. I mean, I was just basically thinking that after the British would support an Ixanian slave revolt, they would subsequently try to invade it, thus pissing off the Ixanians. Then the Ixanians would assist the Union of Sagesse as another separate "country." Of course this would only last until the Atlionese Revolution, when Sagesse would join in on the side of the English speaking colonies. I was just thinking of a reason why Ixania would be independent and pissed off at the Brits. (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (Duestchland - Texas - Oil City - Skandinavia) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 05:19, September 22, 2012 (UTC)
Righto, my two cents: Luminaire was a settlement of the original French colony, but the city itself became a part of the state of Broker before the National Capital Region was designated because it is west of the Dentele River (border between Broker and Intima); Also, National Capital Region was designated in 1800 to stop competition for influence over the nation between cities in the other states. Woogers - talk () 18:01, September 22, 2012 (UTC)
September 24 PROPOSALS
Alright, look at my proposal. I have given basically everyone who has a degree of activity some space to be creative with their history. This proposal allows for a lot of independence as we develop our histories, and I did my research, and it BASICALLY, but not perfectly, fits into British/French/Dutch/Russian history. We'll have to compromise on 100% RL continuity if we hope to do this within this century. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 15:46, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
Now, let us vote:
- -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 15:46, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
- Scott (talk) 16:05, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
- Because I have no part in any of these time periods. Woogers - talk () 18:06, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
- Me gusta (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (Duestchland - Texas - Oil City - Skandinavia) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 20:26, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
DO NOT APPROVE AT ALL
Wish to add/remove something
We have to compromise on the name, since it goes across Edwardsland, New Welland and Vlorast. I don't want to look like I am picking favorites. Perhaps we need to make it something else entirely. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 15:52, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
Actually. The name is not a big deal. If you and the owners of Vlorast and NWelland can agree on a British-style name, go for it :) -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 16:31, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
There's an Asian area around the little peninsula in Vlorast (Vyaalong). They probably didn't arrive there at the same time as the Russians.
I tried to, but the natives thing won't fit in, so I hope Palo Alto is able to compromise since he has also not started developing his history. KK and Psyrax should be ejected IMO. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 08:46, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- I agree. KK and Psyrax rarely made any edits on FW or ConWorlds to begin with. I highly doubt any devotion to Atlion from them all of a sudden. If they are, I may rejoin as one of the mainland states, though thats a big may. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 18:46, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- Oh yes, may I have Psyrax's state if he doesn't return? ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 22:29, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- There are no entry requirements, but you'll have to ask UP if he wants to eject Psyrax. Although I have nothing against you returning, we must both be well aware that there will again be conflict between you and I. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 22:32, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- If we decide there will be conflict. I can go on without fighting just fine, just like I did after the constitution issue. Your attempt to push the Atlion vs. Ixania trial long after no one showed any interest in it was what bothered me. That and numerous other things. So long as you don't make something as issue, and I don't overreact about it, we'll be cooler than UP's ability to swear up a storm and insult people, and then ban others (I mean me) for lacking "proper communication skills". ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 22:54, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- Atlion vs. Ixania would only have happened if Ixania violated the constitution; I wouldn't do something that retarded ICly if there weren't any grounds. Well, I can tell you now, I am going to make things an issue if I feel there is an issue, unfortunately. The history thing is a great example. I went through with my democracy thing and most people have agreed to my idea, thus, we'll have a unified history. I hope now you see my reasoning for it. The one problem is that I see Atlion as one project and you see Atlion as eleven projects (states + capital). That's our fundamental problem. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 23:00, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- From my understanding, I remember you saying you were going to push the issue, but that has cleared now. Also, I don't recall anyone agreeing to have a unified history. No voting, no nothing. Where is it where everyone says that they want a unified history? All I see is everyone showing what their histories were and you just agreeing. And I stick to my views by the way. And please explain what you mean by unified history so I better understand. I feel I'm thinking about something completely different. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 23:15, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- The voting is above this header, plus Falloutfan's only concern was Edwardsland's name. What I mean with "unified" history is a history we all agree on. "We stand united in our view on Atlion's history." Thus, not everyone can go jitter down their own dates and histories on their pages which don't integrate with the other states.
- Not unified: Sagesse is founded in 1600, filled with Native Americans and Broker is founded in 1300, filled with Asians.
- Unified: Sagesse is founded in 1400, filled with Native Americans, and Broker is founded in 1402, filled with Native Americans.
- Unified history = history we all agree on and history that makes sense.
- You read my proposal on the History of Atlion page, then vote above this header or propose your own history, but under no circumstances can we allow people to go rogue with their history. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 23:22, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
- Well then, I'm terribly sorry for the argument that ensued. I believed you meant something completely different from what I was thinking. I totally do that. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 23:35, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
About the Asian thing, I am assuming it's not really a big thing so it only affects your state. You can add that in your state's history, but tomorrow evening, if nobody else has made another proposal, I'll put this in as official (UP still has the final say though), so that will have to fit in with what we put in. So the Asians can come over as cheap labor or something a few years after the Revolution as cheap labor, but you can work out the details. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 18:38, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
I want Psyrax's state. Chiefly, I want to turn it into Asian state. In the early-1700s, after the visit of that British dude (forgot his name), some Chinese sujects were keen to follow, escaping the harsh rule of the Emperor of the China at the time, and breaking the law stating none of the Chinese people were to leave the empire. They first go to Britain, but find there are few opprotunities there, and when newsof Atlion reaches the island, the Chinese expirates move with them. During the war there, they move to the mountains where they are safer from the fighting, and seek to builda new community since the cultural differences with the Europeans has left them outcast from the major cities of that time. Soon enough, those outcasts form the base of the population that become the chief inhabitants of the central region of Albion, by they have no state at the time until the mid-1700s, when the heads of the various communities gather together to draft a charter that would aid them all in the long-run. In the late 1700s, the mountains are home to tens of thousands of the outcasts' desendents, and when exploration of the mountains leads to renewed trade and diplomacy between the inhabitants of the mountains and the Atlionese government, they are offered membership, and join in the year Ablion is united. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 17:39, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
- Oh and my request to have the third largest state by population still remains. :P ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 17:41, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
It seems a small enough of an addition to work, but in my proposal, where Atlion is majorly a product of Europe, a basically only-Asian state is highly unlikely. It can work perhaps if the Asians have adopted French as their language (like many African colonies) or English. That, or the "Europeans" from other states have also moved into that state and now make out more than half of the population. Also, I don't think the most prominent state would have the third highest population. Perhaps take it down to fifth. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 18:34, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Okay, okay. First off, I'm not adopting any languages for the sole reason that English or French will be a secodary language, Chinese being the first. In my city, nearly 80% of all the Asians livng here speak their language (granted, most of them came here for an education). I'll decided on how to handle that later, maybe making my state bilingual.
The population issue is understandable, though given that I plan to have that number explode during the Taipeng and Boxer Rebellions (the Chinese citizens in Atlion had lots of relatives), in which many refugees use the chaos to escape the region and start a new life elsewhere, mainly California and Atlion. Like with any major part of town, the Chinese immigrants shacked up with their own. Also, I have it set up where many Chinese citizens moved to my state looking for work after living the other states or whatever. ((ლ(() (ಠ益ಠ) ((ლ(() 18:54, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Okay then. Here's the deal (and with great modification to the original idea):
- The Chinese get their start in Atlion in 1705, serving as mercenaries for the British. These are Chinese pirates, paid to fight the French naval forces for the British until the British could handle the issue themselves. These pirates serve under the Brits as an alternative to swift execution by the Qing Dynasty which was trying to stamp out piracy, while the British themselves had an interest in China (an OOC fact).
- After returning to China in thr 1720s (they were no longer being hunted), they share stories of Albion, and the untapped wealth of those lands. However, the repressive Manchu rule prevents them from openly leaving China. This leads to smuggling of people out of the empire, and to Britian, where they end up residing for the next couple of years until they have the money to move again.
- During their stay in England, the Chinese expirates pick up English as a second language, and this allows them to easily look for work in Albion after they pick all that can be picked in England as foreigners. They take all their belongings and families, and move once move to Ablion armed with the King's English.
- In Albion, the Chinese immigrents hope that looking for work in the many colonies will be easy. Well, it is; for white people. This widespread stigma toward the "slanty-eyed Orientals" leads to many a fight in the streets of Atlion's cities, and finally a number of murders by xenophobic colonists.
- After the incidents in the towns, the Chinese leaders of the original groups agree to move to the sparsely-populated mountains of central Ablion, where they build a society where they can thrive (much like the Scots who set up shop in modern West Virginia). This leads to second, more public mass exodus, in which thousands of Chinese citizens move to the mountains.
- By the 1760s, the influx of refugees from the misrule of China bolsters the population of Chinese colony. The colony grows overtime as the immigration and traditional birth rate of the Chinese (and come on they are a frisky bunch of people), aids in growth of their settlements.
- As the British and French war on, the Chinese agree that alone they cannot stand, and they formalize the formation of the short-lived Republic of Wushan (Wù shān or 雾山 meaning "mist mountains"). The Wushan republic remains indenpendent up until the unification of Altion, where the nation was viewed as a short-term answer to a long-term issue.
- As the years pass, Wushan remains a popular destination for Oriental civilians to go after looking for work in Atlion, mainly because they have a state that is more tailored to their cultural preferences. During the Taipeng Rebellion, many the state's inhabitants still had family China, and given that nearly 20 million people were killed at the end of the fighting OOC, they were right to try and get them out. They pour money into a fund to pay for charter vessels to pick up refugees and bring them back to Atlion. The fact that hundreds of thousands fled the fighting both OOC and IC, this helps bolster the population of Wushan.
- As the industrialization of Atlion moves ahead, Wushan leads in industry because of the large skilled labour force it possesses, and the fact that the Chinese people have always had strong work ethics. This combination (and that of the mineral-rich mountains that make up Wushan), naturally lead to the state literally becoming the industrial heartland of Atlion (hur).
Alright, I'll try my best to incorporate that into my version of our history, since most of that takes place in the core of the Albionese Revolution. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 20:30, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Read the bold near the end. That's the best I could fit you in. The rest will be history you can write up in an article about the Wushan people. Keep in mind that your history must remain compatible with whatever happens around Wushan. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 18:04, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
It is included. See here: http://conworld.wikia.com/wiki/History_of_Atlion#Unification_period -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 10:00, November 8, 2012 (UTC)
I have just noticed that the English first started being a colonization empire DECADES after they came to Albion. I cannot find any concrete sources, but we need to get it right so we can move the dates around a bit. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 19:22, November 29, 2012 (UTC)
When I made the history I was working under the assumption that the great British colonial empire has existed long before they went to America, but clearly I was wrong. We need to discuss the exact placement of the dates without changing the history itself. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 20:32, November 29, 2012 (UTC)
Yeah, our history is going to change considerably, since some kingdoms and stuff didn't exist to where the dates have to move. I'll see what I can do. -Signed by Warmonkey (talk • contribs) 18:53, December 8, 2012 (UTC)